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Is The Media Afraid Of Doctors?

Last post 04-23-2008, 11:22 AM by analyze0313. 41 replies.
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  •  04-01-2008, 3:51 AM 2698566

    Is The Media Afraid Of Doctors?

    Ang tagal ko ng reklamo to sa media. Bakit walang nakakarating? Ang webmaster ba takot rin?

    I challenge The Probe Team, The Senate, DOH to investigate on the doctors using their power and influence for corruption resulting in harassment and abuse. Or is the media scared? or protecting these doctors? Is the government that willing to sacrifice women, careers and family relationships for the sake of these doctors' selfish and perverse agenda? I have proof, facts and you can even interview actual nurses, medical technologists, sales agents who are constantly being harassed by these doctors.

    Everyday, doctors ask favors from the sales agents, harassing them, going on a power trip. These agents would not dare go against these doctors as they insure valuable sales for their quota. Contracts are signed with something in return, which the companies providing the medicines/reagents/machines/supplies are willing to give to the doctors, even encouraging their agents to be "more than business partners" with the doctors.

    Cars, holiday tickets, 5-star hotel dinners, request for dinner or date with the company's prettiest and sexiest agent, indecent proposals, are often the things involved in securing a big sale. The companies of course, add those expenses to the price of their services/medicines/reagents/machines/supplies. Instead of the funds being used for research and development, providing better and affordable healthcare, these are instead placed for advertising and marketing. to the expense of the safety and dignity of the sales agents.

    Are there no government agency that regulates all these? Are you all scared of these perverts who practice medicine? I can give names just contact me. This must be exposed.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    The Culture Of Bribery
    C.Seamus Hermoso
               
                Medical Representatives as they call it. They are the sales agents of pharmaceutical or diagnostic companies that constantly pursue doctors, chief medical technologists and pathologists in the hospitals. They offer that their medicines and diagnostic equipment be the ones prescribed by the doctor or be used in the hospital. But is the job that simple? Is the offering of products and services merely the presentation of how good the product is, how effective it is?
                A custom in this field that is unfortunately still being practiced is the use of “tokens of favor”. It’s hard to find another term that simply shouts as bribery. Doctors and people who make critical decisions on what medicine, re-agent or equipment to use are ridiculously treated as royalties. They are offered unusually too many company freebies, treated for breakfast, lunch and dinner, treated for a spa or a KTV, given various “gifts” such as plane tickets and tours around the country and abroad all under the expense of the pharmaceutical or diagnostic company.
                And how could the company afford all these? They of course get their money back by adding all those expenses to the prices of the medicines, the machines and the re-agents. These luxury treatment and sales strategy does more harm than good than just keeping quality medicines expensive for the people.
                To cite an example, a certain hospital previously used machines and re-agents from a distributor company that regularly gives away Boracay trips to the doctors and critical decision makers until a competing company upped the ante by offering Hong Kong trips, so the hospital of course now uses the machines and re-agents by the company with the greater offer. The re-agent for the new machine is of course more expensive, and the hospital of course starts charging more for that diagnosis.
                It is not uncommon that medical representatives of these companies must continually adore the doctors, pathologists and medical technologists with gifts, go out on dates and sweet talk them as if they are courting a loved one. Call it sales talk if you want, but there are things that are just too much to stomach. We are not certain who starts these practices; it could be that the company just offers them out of the blue or the doctors, pathologists and medical technologists demand for it.
                The scary part is that the selling of these medicines, re-agents and machines might involve harassment and other indecent proposals. We all know that companies prefer their sales agents to be young and good-looking. A doctor, pathologist or medical technologist could be on a power trip anytime and could pressure a medical representative into something that is not clearly professional anymore like asking for a date, or worse, sexual advances. The agent is trained by the company not to lose a client, and the company would at times encourage their agents to be “more than business partners” to their clients. These are the hidden truths that must be exposed.
                Why couldn’t they just sell the medicines and machines based on the quality or how effective it is? Why couldn’t they just allocate these luxuries spending in research and developing better products?
                Doctors, pathologists and medical technologists are being spoiled too much and proper measures must be set. Companies must at least start practicing some etiquette and cut this lavish spending, this sick adoration on doctors, pathologists and medical technologists as it will only encourage abuse.  
                Doctors and medical technologists on the other hand should stop this power tripping. Just because of their profession, they think they can get away with using their seniority and influence. This is a shout out to everyone in this field to be aware of such things. This is to let everyone know what risks medical sales representatives face each day. This is to tell the medical representatives out there that they can say no to demands that are clearly not professional anymore, that they can report these indecent proposals to the authorities and human rights agencies, and that they can quit the company that encourages such practices.
                Doctors taking advantage and companies that are encouraging such practices must be warned though, that there are lawyers and several human rights advocates just waiting to file a criminal case, in the first sign of a reported harassment.
    ------------------------------------

    Mga Doktor at MedTech, Pinapayaman at Sinusuyo ng mga MedRep.
     
    Hindi ito masyadong binibigyang pansin, ngunit ito’y isang bagay na dapat ng palakihin dahil sa di maganda nitong nadudulot. Mga medical representatives or medrep ang mga kadalasang nasa ospital na makikita mong nanliligaw sa mga doktor na piliin ang produkto nilang gamot at ito ang ireseta sa kanilang mga pasyente. Ang mga doktor dahil sa kanilang posisyon, ay kadalasang natutuksong humingi ng kapalit. Ang mga kompanya naman ng mga medrep ay kinukunsinte ang mga kahilingan ng doktor upang makabenta.
     
    Isa ng kadalasang gawain ay ang paglalabas sa mga doktor at sinasamahan sila kumain sa mamahaling mga kainan, sinasama sa mga bar at KTV, sinasama sa mga out of town at out of country na bakasyon at inaalok ng iba pang regalo at serbisyo. Nakakaawa ang mga medrep na kadalasa’y kababaihan, na tila ibinubugaw ng kanilang mga katrabaho kung sila ay natitipuhan ng isang doktor. Para makabenta ng gamot at mahawakan lahat ng benta sa isang ospital, napipilitan ang mga medrep na suyuin ang mga doktor.
     
    Kung ang dating kagawian na pagbibigay ng regalo sa mga suki, masyado atang sumobra ang pagtrato at pag “Sales Talk” ng mga kumpanya sa mga doktor. Kotse, trip abroad at malamang ay mga “one night stand” ang mga naiaalok sa mga doktor ngayon ng mga kumpanya. Hindi na pagalingan ng gamot at pagandahan ng resulta sa pag gamit ng gamot ang ginagawang bentahan ngayon. Palakihan na ng maiaalok na suhol. Pagandahan ng medrep ng mag-aalok. Kapareha din na sitwasyon nito ang mga medrep na nagbebenta ng mga diagnostic equipment at re-agents na mga medtech naman ang sinusuyo.
     
    May diskriminisasyon sa pagtanggap ng trabaho, dahil mga bata, sexy at magaganda ang mga kadalasang kinukuhang medrep. Tumataas ang presyo ng gamot dahil dito nila binabawi ang nagastos nila sa mga doktor. Laganap ang sekswal na harassment sa mga medrep dahil sa pinapairal ng doktor na kapangyarihan.
     
    Ilan ito sa mga problema ng medrep. Sana ay matugunan ito ng DOH at ng tamang awtoridad at maimbistigahan ang mga ito. Dapat ay magkaron ng memo o guidelines ang mga kumpanya ng pharmaceutical at diagnostics na magkaron naman ng prinsipyo at ethics sa pagbebenta. Wag gumamit ng dirty tactics at suhol. Wag palakihan ng maiaalok. At di dapat tinuturing na tila babaeng laging liniligawan ang mga doktor. Dahil di nakikita ang galing ng produkto sa kahit ano pa mang suhol o landi na dapat gawin.
     
    Hindi dahil mga doktor ang mga clients, e may karapatan sila na humingi sa labis at mangbastos ng mga sales representative. Dapat natin kumilos at magkaroon ng national awareness tungkol dito. Dapat magkaron ng mga seminars sa mga diagnostics at pharmaceutical companies tungkol sa harassment. Dapat rin mailinaw sa mga doktor na pwede silang matanggalan ng lisensya o makulong sa ginagawa nilang pagsasamantala.
  •  04-01-2008, 5:15 PM 2699119 in reply to 2698566

    Re: Is The Media Afraid Of Doctors?

    Somehow somebody is afraid of those on top of the food chain. hehehehe. Pero kung tungkol sa mga snatcher o dun sa mga nasa lower part of the food chain walang problema. Kawawa talaga ang mga mahihirap. Mahirap ka na ikaw pa ang nasa news na contrabida. Mahirap talaga ang mahirap hehehe.


    elgoog
  •  04-02-2008, 12:15 PM 2699831 in reply to 2699119

    Re: Is The Media Afraid Of Doctors?

    AND WE JUST DO WHAT?

    SHAKE OUR HEADS AND SAY "Oh Well"?

    I CHOOSE TO FIGHT.

     I CHOOSE TO CHANGE THE SYSTEM.

     
    JESUS IS JUST ONE MAN.

    HITLER IS JUST ONE MAN.

    RIZAL IS JUST ONE MAN.

     

    I CHALLENGE THESE PERVERTED DOCTORS TO FACE ME.

    I VOW, DUMADAMI NA KAMI, AND WE WILL BRING YOU DOWN. WE WILL RUIN YOUR REPUTATIONS AND YOUR CAREER UNLESS YOU START CHANGING.

    IKAW NA NAGBABASA NITO!

    OO IKAW!

    ANONG GAGAWIN MO KUNG ANG ASAWA MO, ANAK MO, KAPATID MO, O KAIBIGAN MO NA BABAE ANG BABASTUSIN NG MGA GAGONG DOCTOR NA TO?!

     
    KUMILOS NA TAYO. WALA KONG PAKIALAM KUNG SINONG MAYAYAMAN YAN AT MAIIMPLUWENSYA. TAYO ANG NASA TAMA.
     

  •  04-02-2008, 12:21 PM 2699838 in reply to 2699831

    Re: Is The Media Afraid Of Doctors?

    get the evidence then expose them to the media....
    Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people.
  •  04-03-2008, 8:38 AM 2700517 in reply to 2699838

    Re: Is The Media Afraid Of Doctors?

    are there not enough evidence already?

    real life testimonies? people in forums, friends, total strangers, people in the medical field all agreed when asked about the issue, they all said one thing: it is a fact, it is an open secret.

     i have the testimonies, from companies themselves. i have accounts of various people involved.

     
    AM I STILL NOT EXPOSING THIS TO THE MEDIA?!

    I AM JUST GETTING STARTED. BUT I AM ASKING FOR HELP.  

     
    I WROTE TO ALMOST ALL NEWS TEAMS, INVESTIGATIVE JOURNALISTS, BROADSHEETS, EVEN WOMEN'S HELP DESKS, STILL...IT SEEMS NO ONE IS INTERESTED.

     
    GMA-7? ABS-CBN? ALL COHORTS UNDER THIS CORRUPT SYSTEM.

    SO I GUESS THEN, THE ANSWER IS YES. THE MEDIA IS AFRAID.

    I PITY YOU.

    IM NOT AFRAID OF THESE DOCTORS. YOUR INFLUENCES DISGUSTS ME. I AM COMING FOR YOU. YOU KNOW WHO YOU PEOPLE ARE. UST HOSPITAL. PGH. OSPITAL NG MAYNILA. SEAMEN'S HOSPITAL.
     

  •  04-03-2008, 8:45 AM 2700530 in reply to 2700517

    Re: Is The Media Afraid Of Doctors?

    cmus02:

    are there not enough evidence already?

    real life testimonies? people in forums, friends, total strangers, people in the medical field all agreed when asked about the issue, they all said one thing: it is a fact, it is an open secret.

     i have the testimonies, from companies themselves. i have accounts of various people involved.


    AM I STILL NOT EXPOSING THIS TO THE MEDIA?!

    I AM JUST GETTING STARTED. BUT I AM ASKING FOR HELP.  


    I WROTE TO ALMOST ALL NEWS TEAMS, INVESTIGATIVE JOURNALISTS, BROADSHEETS, EVEN WOMEN'S HELP DESKS, STILL...IT SEEMS NO ONE IS INTERESTED.


    GMA-7? ABS-CBN? ALL COHORTS UNDER THIS CORRUPT SYSTEM.

    SO I GUESS THEN, THE ANSWER IS YES. THE MEDIA IS AFRAID.

    I PITY YOU.

    IM NOT AFRAID OF THESE DOCTORS. YOUR INFLUENCES DISGUSTS ME. I AM COMING FOR YOU. YOU KNOW WHO YOU PEOPLE ARE. UST HOSPITAL. PGH. OSPITAL NG MAYNILA. SEAMEN'S HOSPITAL.
     

    how about nbi? have you tried them?
    Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people.
  •  04-06-2008, 3:09 PM 2703385 in reply to 2700530

    Re: Is The Media Afraid Of Doctors?

    prince:
    cmus02:

    are there not enough evidence already?

    real life testimonies? people in forums, friends, total strangers, people in the medical field all agreed when asked about the issue, they all said one thing: it is a fact, it is an open secret.

     i have the testimonies, from companies themselves. i have accounts of various people involved.


    AM I STILL NOT EXPOSING THIS TO THE MEDIA?!

    I AM JUST GETTING STARTED. BUT I AM ASKING FOR HELP.  


    I WROTE TO ALMOST ALL NEWS TEAMS, INVESTIGATIVE JOURNALISTS, BROADSHEETS, EVEN WOMEN'S HELP DESKS, STILL...IT SEEMS NO ONE IS INTERESTED.


    GMA-7? ABS-CBN? ALL COHORTS UNDER THIS CORRUPT SYSTEM.

    SO I GUESS THEN, THE ANSWER IS YES. THE MEDIA IS AFRAID.

    I PITY YOU.

    IM NOT AFRAID OF THESE DOCTORS. YOUR INFLUENCES DISGUSTS ME. I AM COMING FOR YOU. YOU KNOW WHO YOU PEOPLE ARE. UST HOSPITAL. PGH. OSPITAL NG MAYNILA. SEAMEN'S HOSPITAL.
     

    how about nbi? have you tried them?

    Because no crime was involved police agencies will be hesitant to pursue the matter.

    I suggest you go to the regulating/licensing authority for doctors and file a complaint on the grounds of immoral conduct by the doctor/s involved and request an investigation. Get as much signatures from the agents who have been victimized. The more signatures the better.

     

    Good luck on your crusade.

     


    A journey always starts with the first step.
  •  04-06-2008, 3:13 PM 2703387 in reply to 2703385

    Re: Is The Media Afraid Of Doctors?

    Lazzaluv:
    prince:
    cmus02:

    are there not enough evidence already?

    real life testimonies? people in forums, friends, total strangers, people in the medical field all agreed when asked about the issue, they all said one thing: it is a fact, it is an open secret.

     i have the testimonies, from companies themselves. i have accounts of various people involved.


    AM I STILL NOT EXPOSING THIS TO THE MEDIA?!

    I AM JUST GETTING STARTED. BUT I AM ASKING FOR HELP.  


    I WROTE TO ALMOST ALL NEWS TEAMS, INVESTIGATIVE JOURNALISTS, BROADSHEETS, EVEN WOMEN'S HELP DESKS, STILL...IT SEEMS NO ONE IS INTERESTED.


    GMA-7? ABS-CBN? ALL COHORTS UNDER THIS CORRUPT SYSTEM.

    SO I GUESS THEN, THE ANSWER IS YES. THE MEDIA IS AFRAID.

    I PITY YOU.

    IM NOT AFRAID OF THESE DOCTORS. YOUR INFLUENCES DISGUSTS ME. I AM COMING FOR YOU. YOU KNOW WHO YOU PEOPLE ARE. UST HOSPITAL. PGH. OSPITAL NG MAYNILA. SEAMEN'S HOSPITAL.
     

    how about nbi? have you tried them?

    Because no crime was involved police agencies will be hesitant to pursue the matter.

    I suggest you go to the regulating/licensing authority for doctors and file a complaint on the grounds of immoral conduct by the doctor/s involved and request an investigation. Get as much signatures from the agents who have been victimized. The more signatures the better.

    Good luck on your crusade.

     

    well nbi is suppose to be like fbi here, they are very good in investigating cases like these...
    Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people.
  •  04-07-2008, 11:51 AM 2704259 in reply to 2703387

    Re: Is The Media Afraid Of Doctors?

    yung ganyang thinking ang nakaka piss off. here are my answers to these generalized things you have said. "there are things you can't change" - this is lame. its like dying without even trying. kaya ganito pilipinas dahil sa thinking na ganito. basta kumakaen ka 3 times a day, may bahay ka, masaya ka na. walang pakialam sa pagbabago. isang reason bakit isa sa mga forums na ito ang pinostan ko nito. dahil alam ko, car clubs, mga nasa middle to upper class. at possibleng may mga doktor dito. gising hoy! "mag isa ka lang, what can you do about it" - again, this won't discourage me. it would just put me more on the offensive. mag-isa pa la ko? sige, lets see about that. magugulat ka what man can do. saka ang reasoning na to, parang guilty ka. parang isa ka sa mga gumawa ng kalokohan, kaya psyche up sarili mo, into thinking na wala magagawa ang mag-isa. na untouchable ka. guess again. im on to you. "ganyan talaga systema, kung walang magpapaloko walang manloloko." - this is also lame. jinusjustify ang evil act as if ginusto yun ng offended party. para mong sinabi na: kaya ka na-rape kase nagsuot ka ng malaswang damit; kaya ka nanakawan kasi iniwan mo nakabukas pinto mo. lame. lets think pare. ano ang mas masama? mag iwan ng pinto na nakabukas? o magnakaw? parang sinasabi mo na kasalanan pa ng biktima. again, depensa to ng guilty. isa ka rin siguro sa mga nang aabuso. DOH? like they would care. e isa sila sa mga nabibiyayaan ng mga companies. "its ok to go to dates, as long as the company pays for it" - may nagsabi ng ganito. ano ka ba? di mo naisip san kinukuha ng company ang pera? instead of putting FUNDS for RESEARCH and DEVELOPMENT, benefits ng employees, HEALTHCARE, insurance, proper facilities, gumagastos sila para sa marketing na hindi naman ganun kalaki dapat. PLANE TICKETS TO HONGKONG? ibibigay lang sa doctor? sobrang spoiled na ata. worst part alam kung ano? babawiin ng company ang gastos nila. saan? BY PUTTING A HIGH PRICE TAG ON THE MEDICINES/ OR THE SERVICES/ OR THE MACHINES/REAGENTS... at syempre, kawawa ang taong may sakit. Naging mahal lahat para lang sa doctor na kelangan suyuin. kelangan may REGULATING BODY. Journalists?! Scared naman din ata sila.
  •  04-08-2008, 6:17 AM 2704888 in reply to 2704259

    Re: Is The Media Afraid Of Doctors?

    gaano ba ka effective ang licensing board sa pinas? do they really investigate wrongdoings ng mga professionals, on this case doctors?
    Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people.
  •  04-08-2008, 8:11 PM 2705614 in reply to 2704888

    Re: Is The Media Afraid Of Doctors?

    prince:
    gaano ba ka effective ang licensing board sa pinas? do they really investigate wrongdoings ng mga professionals, on this case doctors?

    Well they should investigate. Especially when there is a complaint of misconduct, malpractice, immorality and gross negligence of the license holder.


    A journey always starts with the first step.
  •  04-08-2008, 9:13 PM 2705647 in reply to 2705614

    Re: Is The Media Afraid Of Doctors?

    Lazzaluv:

    prince:
    gaano ba ka effective ang licensing board sa pinas? do they really investigate wrongdoings ng mga professionals, on this case doctors?

    Well they should investigate. Especially when there is a complaint of misconduct, malpractice, immorality and gross negligence of the license holder.

    I know that they should but how often do they do it and how the public knows? Here in the US the guilty professionals are in the licensure website stating their faults and it shows that they are under disciplinary action...everyone can access it....all you need is their name and profession....
    Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people.
  •  04-08-2008, 9:22 PM 2705650 in reply to 2705647

    Re: Is The Media Afraid Of Doctors?

    prince:
    Lazzaluv:

    prince:
    gaano ba ka effective ang licensing board sa pinas? do they really investigate wrongdoings ng mga professionals, on this case doctors?

    Well they should investigate. Especially when there is a complaint of misconduct, malpractice, immorality and gross negligence of the license holder.

    I know that they should but how often do they do it and how the public knows? Here in the US the guilty professionals are in the licensure website stating their faults and it shows that they are under disciplinary action...everyone can access it....all you need is their name and profession....

    How often? Well I think every time there is a complaint, ano.

    That licensure web should be a good deterrent for wrongdoers.

     


    A journey always starts with the first step.
  •  04-08-2008, 10:14 PM 2705689 in reply to 2705650

    Re: Is The Media Afraid Of Doctors?

    maganda nga dito dahil malalaman mo kung legit ang lisensya ng tao sa website lang...at kung active pa or hinde.
    Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people.
  •  04-08-2008, 10:32 PM 2705710 in reply to 2705689

    Re: Is The Media Afraid Of Doctors?

    prince:
    maganda nga dito dahil malalaman mo kung legit ang lisensya ng tao sa website lang...at kung active pa or hinde.

    Correct ! That’s why we need a National Broadband Network !


    A journey always starts with the first step.
  •  04-08-2008, 11:10 PM 2705744 in reply to 2705710

    Re: Is The Media Afraid Of Doctors?

    Lazzaluv:

    prince:
    maganda nga dito dahil malalaman mo kung legit ang lisensya ng tao sa website lang...at kung active pa or hinde.

    Correct ! That’s why we need a National Broadband Network !

    is that a requirement in order to have a website?
    Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people.
  •  04-09-2008, 8:34 AM 2706166 in reply to 2705744

    Re: Is The Media Afraid Of Doctors?

    Lumang issue na ito. Hindi lang sa med reps nangyayari ito, but anyone who is in the field of sales. It's not uncommon for a sales agent to woo their clients. Meron nga sales agent from a certain car company who would offer "extras" just to get her quota. And I don't mean those freebies for a car either. Customers who can afford dine the agents, treat them out, etc. It's part of sales. If this is investigated, might as well investigate the whole field of marketing, but then again that would definitely bring down many companies, and not just the medical industry. Are you still wondering then why this isn't investigated?
    More honourable than the Cherubim, and far glorious beyond compare than the Seraphim. Without defilement, you gave birth to God the Word. True Theotokos, we magnify you.

    Join my message board:
  •  04-09-2008, 9:01 PM 2706793 in reply to 2706166

    Re: Is The Media Afraid Of Doctors?

    Milliardo:
    Lumang issue na ito. Hindi lang sa med reps nangyayari ito, but anyone who is in the field of sales. It's not uncommon for a sales agent to woo their clients. Meron nga sales agent from a certain car company who would offer "extras" just to get her quota. And I don't mean those freebies for a car either. Customers who can afford dine the agents, treat them out, etc. It's part of sales. If this is investigated, might as well investigate the whole field of marketing, but then again that would definitely bring down many companies, and not just the medical industry. Are you still wondering then why this isn't investigated?

    I don’t think cmus02 was calling for an investigation of the sales & marketing SOP. He was calling for the investigation of immoral practices or inappropriate behavior of some doctors.


    A journey always starts with the first step.
  •  04-09-2008, 9:08 PM 2706797 in reply to 2705744

    Re: Is The Media Afraid Of Doctors?

    prince:
    Lazzaluv:

    prince:
    maganda nga dito dahil malalaman mo kung legit ang lisensya ng tao sa website lang...at kung active pa or hinde.

    Correct ! That’s why we need a National Broadband Network !

    is that a requirement in order to have a website?

    Not necessarily, but as the name implies, it will be nationwide, therefore easier to access and faster.


    A journey always starts with the first step.
  •  04-10-2008, 10:50 AM 2707506 in reply to 2706166

    Re: Is The Media Afraid Of Doctors?

    Milliardo:
    Lumang issue na ito. Hindi lang sa med reps nangyayari ito, but anyone who is in the field of sales. It's not uncommon for a sales agent to woo their clients. Meron nga sales agent from a certain car company who would offer "extras" just to get her quota. And I don't mean those freebies for a car either. Customers who can afford dine the agents, treat them out, etc. It's part of sales. If this is investigated, might as well investigate the whole field of marketing, but then again that would definitely bring down many companies, and not just the medical industry. Are you still wondering then why this isn't investigated?
    nabuhay ka! welcome uli...i noticed your avatar wicked...sikat dito sa chicago yan and i think may tour sila...i have not seen it pero my friend plays some music on that play...
    Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people.
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